| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 48 post(s) |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
2
   |
Posted - 2012.06.22 12:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ahh c'mon.
It's pretty obvious that CCP just totally meta gamed GSF, derr...
Ofc CCP knew about this before inferno went live, and Ofc CCP knew Goons would game it thinking they were clever. Right?
Now CCP devs are all down the pub clincking drinks and deciding how hard to swing the ban hammer.
No seriously, thanks for the entertainment goonies, its why we all love eve. Keep it up. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
2
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 05:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
I doubt CCP would deem blowing up your own freighters filled with literally billions of ISK worth of loot to work the game mechanics for personal gain as "working as intended".
Should the mechanics have been tested better - they were probably tested adequately enough and i'm sure CCP were aware of the possibility this could happen - but they prob assumed that outliers in this magnitude would not be taken advantage of....
That was their mistake.
Its not "breaking the sandbox" to reverse any gains made by a few highly dedicated, organized and intelligent players, and any players who have received a donation from it.
I think the only question CCP are contemplating is whether or not bans are required for knowing a game mechanic could be used in such a way and taking advantage of it instead of doing the "right" thing and filing a detailed bug report - including the "uber spreadsheet".
The funny thing is that the guys involved are now minus all the ISK they invested with no profit to show.... Only gain is street (forum) credit for pulling off the heist. Which is all they Probably care about anyway.
I think its pretty cool what they did - congratz guys. But CCP do need to take your sack of loot i'm afraid :(
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Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 05:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Events like this and many in the past have been, and should be taken on a case by case basis.
We wait with baited breath..... |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 06:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
Elecktra Blue wrote:So I'm curious, the people that said they acted upon this "issue" after seeing the document "leak" on twitter, should be in the same boat by CCP's investigative definition. Yes I am talking about Jade Constantine, who admitted to making over 8B after this document leak, and I imagine there are others as well, should they not be under investigation as well? Or is this simply a crusade against those the high-sec population loathe?
IF that can be proven that they saw the leaked document - Can it be proven. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 06:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
Elecktra Blue wrote:Elysium Foxx wrote:Elecktra Blue wrote:So I'm curious, the people that said they acted upon this "issue" after seeing the document "leak" on twitter, should be in the same boat by CCP's investigative definition. Yes I am talking about Jade Constantine, who admitted to making over 8B after this document leak, and I imagine there are others as well, should they not be under investigation as well? Or is this simply a crusade against those the high-sec population loathe? IF that can be proven that they saw the leaked document - Can it be proven. I just do not like Jade heh.
And that he/her profit was made before seeing the leaked doc, Now- can that be proven? |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 06:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
why the hell is this relevant[/quote]
Because these ppl were only taking advantage of artificially inflated system rating - (inflated by the ppl who were actually gaming the flawed game mechanics) - to get maximum benefit from the LP they had been holding, and not actually abusing the flawed mechanics themselves. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
4
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 15:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
oh hahaha, look at all the goon tears
Priceless, maybe you should put all those priceless tears in one of your own freighters and blow it up in Yulai.
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Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 08:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
so i have this text book i'm using for a University degree - in it it has a definition of an exploit.
blah blah.... or, an exploit can be a documented process to take advantage of a vulnerability or exposure, usually in software, that is either inherent in the software or is created by the attacker. .... blah blah.
page 10 chapter 1
Principles of Information Security
by, Michael E. Whitman & Herbert J. Mattord
Just thought i'd share that with the thread. Not sure if its relevant. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 08:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Elysium Foxx wrote:so i have this text book i'm using for a University degree - in it it has a definition of an exploit.
blah blah.... or, an exploit can be a documented process to take advantage of a vulnerability or exposure, usually in software, that is either inherent in the software or is created by the attacker. .... blah blah.
page 10 chapter 1
Principles of Information Security
by, Michael E. Whitman & Herbert J. Mattord
Just thought i'd share that with the thread. Not sure if its relevant. This was not taking advantage of a vulnerability or exposure, though. It was just maths and nothing broke. Bad design is not vulnerability. It's just bad design.
So you think using maths to create "free" LP would not break the system (EVE economy) if it was left as it was?
In other words - you think if nothing had changed that this would not leave the system vulnerable.
The system was flawed, had a vulnerability to abuse - it was abused, therefore, it was exploited.
But keep buzzing, maybe if you say it enough times you will brainwash CCP into believing you. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 08:30:00 -
[10] - Quote
Yeh, maybe we should count the amount of posts in this thread.
a percentage of Goon+ goon supporter posts to others posts.
See how deep that pool of tears actually is. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 08:42:00 -
[11] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:Elysium Foxx wrote:Yeh, maybe we should count the amount of threads.
a percentage of Goon+ goon supporter posts to others posts.
See how deep that pool of tears actually is. it really has nothing to do with "supporting goons" at all. the entire point is whether they were within the limits of the sandbox or not. to me, they were. ccp added the formula to reward lp on a sliding scale based on the isk damage inflicted upon an enemy when their ship went pop. ok, manipulating the average price on an item was a bit close to the line, but isn't that what people sit in jita and do all day every day anyway? the only real difference between what goons did, and what your average player does on a daily basis is scale, and scale is the only thing that's caused an issue here. at least, as far as i can tell.
I actually agree with you to a certain degree, and think what these guys did is impressive and could really only be done effectively with massive amounts of collateral, however, the fact is they exploited a known vulnerability in a system and should get punished.
I personally think that removing any assets and ISK they made from this venture, leaving the offenders out of pocket the amount that they investeted is enough of a punishment. But they did exploit the system, and CCP's own rules state that anyone exploiting the system will be subject to potential bans. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 08:49:00 -
[12] - Quote
Agreed (flogging dead horses makes the meat more tender though), will be very interesting to see CCP's response to this whole mess. Respect will be both earnt and lost whatever they do. Who's respect do they value the most? |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 09:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
..........blah, blah
A similar thing may have happened if someone in a FW was running such a scam, hauling a hundred of items he buys 1m and sell 1b, got blown up and the killer received LP based on 100*500m. He, too, would have received a huge amount of isk. And it wouldnt have been "exploiting a bug". [/quote wrote:
This post is absolutely brilliant.
Thank you for the /thread.
no it would not have been exploiting a bug, since he had no knowledge the bug existed. You obviously have no idea what you are talking about. |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 09:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
I think the minmatar faction leader would be sad that one of his own FW members would purposely blow up freighter loads of his own precious items that could have been used to help the faction war effort. Role playing is truely dead in EVE....
:( |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 09:35:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:Elysium Foxx wrote:I think the minmatar faction leader would be sad that one of his own FW members would purposely blow up freighter loads of his own precious items that could have been used to help the faction war effort. Role playing is truely dead in EVE....
:( i think it's very much alive, actually. this game brings out the most sly, underhand, and interesting parts of a person's character. between the anonymity of the internet, and the game's design almost rewarding ******* people over it lets you be that devious person you probably can't be in the real world.
haha, yeh i guess you could spin it that way. : )
well played |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
10
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 13:50:00 -
[16] - Quote
I'm not sure the PI, PA, tracking Titans, or insurance scam really hold any relevance to this event.
None of those had the potential to endlessly print LP that could be used to completely ruin faction warfare and crash entire sections of markets whilst also making anyone who took part in the exploit insanely rich.
This event will be, and should be handled on its own merits, and any abuse of exploits bugs etc. in the past and going into the future should be handled on a case by case basis. That is just the way things are... If you don't understand that you are a fool.
Lets be clear this WAS abusing an exploit. Please stop referring to RL situations and wiki references. If you are going to use a reference use a viable, peer reviewed, professionally respected one, such as this text book i'm using for a University degree - which has a definition of an exploit.
"blah blah.... or, an exploit can be a documented process to take advantage of a vulnerability or exposure, usually in software, that is either inherent in the software or is created by the attacker. .... blah blah."
page 10 chapter 1
Principles of Information Security
by, Michael E. Whitman & Herbert J. Mattord
The so called "faction five" have clearly abused a known vulnerability in the game mechanics, and should be punished accordingly.
Its actually quite amusing that they thought nothing would happen, did they really think they'd get to keep the ISK, LP and assets, really? Oh no thats right, they were helping CCP to make the game better for all of us - lol |
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